His and Her Health

New member here. I have been married for 24 years. I have never had an orgasm in my life and recently have had a problem with vaginal dryness (after intercourse has begun). The doctor has found no physical problems with me and my DH is a good and caring lover. Now that the kids are gone we want to work on improving this area of our marriage.<P>We have been looking on the internet and have come across herbal supplements that claim to help with dryness and inability to orgasm with pills and cream (I will not identify them due to the posting rules) by increasing blood flow to the vagina. They "claim" it will increase sensitivity and wetness. Has anybody ever used these types of products and if so, did they work for you?

I have never tried the herbals, though I've not heard much good about most of them (damiana being the exception, but I really don't know a lot about it). I do know, however, that viagra can really help increase your internal lubrication by facilitating blood flow. For some women, it can also help orgasm capability. Some doctors will perscribe viagra off-label for women.

<B>Tiny_59</B><P>You appear to be near the right age to be reaching menopause. Loss of lubrication and tissue atrophy often occurs with the loss of estrogen. <P>Could this be a possibility?<P>Could you desribe the physical review your doctor did? Is he/she specially trained in sexual function issues, or simply a OB/GYN? Was there any check of hormones etc? If so, which hormones were checked and what were the results? (I know you didn't ask about this specifically, but I thought I'd ask. You're welcome to answer or not, as you see fit.)<P>I'm very skeptical about any "herbal" products. Many are not scientifically designed or tested. Many seem to just be a way to part the customer from their money. However, I must say, I have seen herbal products that are pretty amazing - Zestra is one of these. I don't expect it will dramatially improve your lubrication issues, though it might make some small changes.<P>Some don't care for the smell, etc. If you choose to buy some, start with a small purchase to make sure you like the product.<P><BR>Finally, we have always had to use lubricant in very liberal amounts. This might be a partial solution for you, though I'd probably not ignore the symptoms you're having - they might become much larger problems. The two/three best lubricants I'm aware of are:<P>Astrolide. Water based. Dries out fairly quickly, at least for us.<P>Eros or Wet Platinum: Silicone based. Works well in water - doesn't easily rinse off. (Great for the shower etc.) Doesn't dry out. Not as slick as Astroglide, but pretty good.<P>Best wishes,<BR>Greg<P>Also note, I am *not* a doctor, and this is not intended as medical advice - Please talk to your doctor about your concerns.<BR><p>[Note: This message has been edited by NEWSHE Moderator]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by distressed_12345:<BR><B>[b]Finally, we have always had to use lubricant in very liberal amounts.</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>That would be a sign your wife is not aroused. Unless the dryness was a menopausal symptom, I never thought people should rely on lubricants so much. It's not giving the woman a chance to become aroused enuf to have natural wetness. If I'm not wet, I'm not aroused and I'm not going to enjoy intercourse without being aroused. On a broader level, I don't think it's respectful of the woman you're with to do that when she's not ready for it. On the other hand, some men don't know it takes females longer to become aroused so this could be a good piece of information.<P><p>[This message has been edited by Phamyl (edited 23 September 2003).]

Those are some rather harsh statements to make, and not at all foregone conlcusions. Simply because you can get wet when you are suitable aroused does not mean all women can or do. That assumption dismisses the situation, and isn't helpful. <P>Yes, women can take longer to become aroused than men, and some men don't know this. So, some good questions are how long do the two of you spend on foreplay? Does she enjoy foreplay? What types of things do the two of you do to help her get sexually aroused? When you are ready for penetration, is she interested and excited about it, as well? The answers to these questions may help the poster, as well as those of us who are trying to help him, narrow down the problem without being accusatory. The poster you quote, actually, has addressed these issues already elsewhere, and is well aware of how long it can take a woman to reach appropriate arousal.<P>Actually, there are other reasons for lack of natural lubrication besides menopause and lack of arousal. Certain medications, for example, or lack of proper hydration (though I was always Niagra Falls in regards to wetness, if I was dehydrated--which I occasionally did intentionally for longer canoe trips with no bathroom opportunities--I would be bone dry regardless of arousal). Some chronic conditions, such as diabetes. Also, time in her cycle can cause different amounts of lubrication. Low estrogen, which can occur at any time of life, not just at menopause. Birth control medications can impact wetness. And, some women are just wetter than others naturally, regardless of arousal. Some women also dry out during vaginal sex, not from lack of arousal, but simply because that is the way their body works.<P>If proper foreplay and time is given to arouse the women, and she is indeed interested in sexual contact and play, then using lubricants is not disrespectful--it is helping her pleasure at least as much as his. <P><p>[This message has been edited by dona1 (edited 23 September 2003).]

He did say they have always had to use liberal lubrication so I took this to mean it wasn't a once in a while type of occurrence.<P>I don't agree with something else you said. Women who dry out during intercourse usually become dry because of lack of arousal.

Tiny,<P>You spoke only of vaginal intercourse. Stimulating your clitoris is usually the easiest route to take. I say get a good book on the subject and have fun learning. It's usually 90% fixable!

Thanks for the replies. I was hoping that I could get a response from someone who has actually tried them. To be specific (and run the risk of deletion from the moderator), I was thinking of buying EvaMax. Does anybody know anything about it?

No, actually, women don't always dry out during intercourse due to lack of arousal. It's an evaporation rate vs. lubrication production rate issues for some women, and yes, I have been there. Not often, but occasionally.<P>I don't believe I ever said that Distressed's post said that their use of lubricant was occasional. I don't put words into other people's mouths. <P>My point was that some women, regardless of excellent arousal, still need or prefer to use lubricants. If this helps their enjoyment, calling it disprespectful isn't appropriate. Even having been brought to orgasm first, which I would have to consider proper arousal, some women still don't have copious amounts of natural lubricant. I am not quite sure why this is a difficult concept to grasp--every woman is different in this area, as well as many others. Your personal experience is different from other women's, as is my own. That does not make either experience any less valid. For example, I used to get so wet that it was overkill--my entire bottom and upper legs would be soaked, and I didn't even really need to be that aroused. Sometimes I would be just "normally" wet, and be just as or more aroused. Sometimes, I would need lubrication even if I'd already orgasmed a few times and was wild to have sex. Fluctuation in natural lubrication is common, and often happens in tune with a woman's cycle. For other women, it just doesn't happen at all--my ex roommate is one of these. She and I roomed together for 2 years. Her boyfriend at the time was, she said, a good lover and judging from the noise level, I had to accept that. But, she wasn't ever very wet, and said she dried out a lot very quickly during intercourse even when she was enjoying it. She finally got some Astroglide (I had to got with her, because she was shy about adult stores), and loved it. It wasn't her arousal that was a problem it was just her natural lubricant level. She was a very active (runner, actually) and healthy young woman in every other respect. Whether it was lack of bloodflow (which has been a proven issue with lack of lubrication--hence, the clinical trials of Viagra and why some women have already found it helpful in that area), or just her body's natural way? I am not sure, but since there was no way to test that at the time, this was a great alternative for her.<P>Women have different means of orgasm, length of periods, bladder capacity, water retention in the body, and amount of saliva in their mouths. All of these are natural bodily differences, just as lubrication is. Gyns often recommend lubricant for issues such as this, and not all gyns are full of it (some, admittedly, are--but there are some good ones out there, as well). Many women also use lubricants when they are masturbating. If they are masturbating because they are aroused, it would follow by your theory that they should get wet enough to do so without lubricant. If folks want, feel free to put in an informal poll on this..do you use lubricant even when you're aroused, and/or masturbating? So, it's not always fair (though it's certainly easier) to blame the man, or call him disprespectful. Is it the case sometimes? Certainly. Just not always.<P><p>[This message has been edited by dona1 (edited 24 September 2003).]

I grasp your concept and still disagree. I used the word "usually". Usually women dry out during intercourse from lack of arousal. I've talked to plenty of my girlfriends over the years and this is what I believe for myself. You're seeing female sexuality as a logical response to male sexuality and intercourse when it isn't for most women in my opinion. A woman can "say" she's aroused. The fact is what a woman's body is doing physically and what she says she is feeling sexually, surprisingly, are not well correlated. If women weren't so conditioned to see themselves as a logical counterpart to men, they'd be much more in tune with their own bodies, like most men are. (Think back on who have been your best male lovers and why) No biggie. I respect your opinion. It's a longstanding point of debate that won't be resolved here and now. Have a great day! We're enjoying beautiful weather in my part of the world!<p>[This message has been edited by Phamyl (edited 24 September 2003).]

To the original poster, have you done any research on damiana? I know it's one of the herbs that has more research to back it in the sexual arena than most, but I admit I don't know a lot about it. Zaneblue probably has more info, so maybe she'll post, but you can likely simply look it up on the web.

Hi Dona-- Scientific data supporting the categorization of damiana as an aphrodisiac is thin. One study had been done on male rats. Damiana is estrogenic if anything.<BR><A HREF="www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?c...;dopt=Abstract" TARGET=_blank>www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?c...p;db=PubMed&list _uids=11611156&dopt=Abstract</A><p>[This message has been edited by Phamyl (edited 24 September 2003).]

The reason why research is thin is actually because it's non-existent. Only one study has been done, and that was on men. Why would someone do research on it when damiana can't be patented? On the other hand, every herbal mix for women that has been tested that has shown effectiveness has contained damiana. <P>My personal opinion is that for women who find anxiety and stress are the source of their FSD, then damiana very well may help. It's not an herb that's supposed to affect FSD indirectly through hormone levels; it's fast-acting. It's available over the counter at most drugstores, try a pill and if you like the effect, there you go. I think it would have the best results in women who find that a glass of wine helps things along too.<P>I've been reluctant to post in this thread because frankly I think the poster would benefit more from a vibrator than some herb mix.<P>Whoo boy, I looked that product up. It's over a hundred dollars for a 30-day supply!!! I am skeptical of everything-but-the-kitchen-sink products like that (I'm amused to see it too contains damiana). Humor me. I really don't think placenta (eeeeewwww! ) is going to help with FSD, and DHEA should probably only be taken under a doctor's advice. Notice the product is chock full of vitamins. Try this instead for a month. First, take that hundred dollars and buy a good vibrator! Hitachi Magic Wand or an Eroscillator are good choices. Then, for a month take a good multivitamin like Centrum every day. Take an extra 400 IU of vitamin E and drink a big glass of orange juice (or take some vitamin C). Take the full RDA of calcium/magnesium/zinc (usually three pills a day). Try for at least twelve mg a day of iron (if your multi doesn't have it, take an additional iron pill once every few days). Finally, take double the recommended dosage of fish oil a day (six grams which is six pills, I know it's a lot). I know it's a lot of pills to take, but it's still going to be cheaper than that stuff, and you know what's going into your body. I'm pretty sure it will work better than that product.<P>For extra benefit, try to cut down on caffeine (and cigarettes if you smoke) and try to eat some good dark chocolate every day.<P>